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1) Going into an impromptu sermon in between songs or mid-song. A few words of encouragement, challenge or reflection is cool but the if it goes longer than your song..overkill.
2) Repeating the same line in a song 3.6 million times. there's the Spirit's leading and then there's just plain losing people.
2. Typos on the screen.
3. Makes us shake hands with the people around us. :) LEAST FAVORITE PART OF CHURCH.
4. Talks like they're at a high school pep rally. "Let me hear ya!"
5. Looks or sounds seductive.
6. Inauthentic prayer--too scripted or so random that it doesn't make sense, or rushed/dragged out to make the prayer fit the interlude.
(I'm a tad opinionated. Sorry.)
All to often, I think this is simply so they can see everyone raising their hands and feel good that they got everyone involved instead of letting people worship God the way He is calling them to worship. I've had worship leaders completely distract me from God when they start telling me what to do.
Don't get me wrong, having everyone stand at the beginning of the set to get people to wake up is fine. But if its in the middle of a song or the middle of the set, I don't want to be told how to worship.
"I'll never know how much it cost..." becomes
"I'll never know how mu..SH@T cost..."
Now that I think about it...that's kinda funny...
2. As a Pastor I hate it when the music guy/gal is lazy apart from their 30 minute set on Sundays.
3. I hate it when the music guy/gal asks the crowd to praise God but soaks it up like they are Bono and the crowd is really praising them.
What I do like is when we're given the option to stand or sit or kneel - whatever it takes for us to worship...so then the focus is not on us watching the band or merely singing along.
I also like how worship leaders/team make mistakes when between songs or even during songs..and they can smile about it and move on smoothly - because they're not perfect!
Do the stewards who hand around the buckets also get to welcome people on behalf of the stewards?
(Maybe that only bugs me because he says the same thing EVERY time he leads).
Actually maybe that is it maybe it is just the use of canned phrases.
seriously?
yeah he said it was to warm not only our voices but our our hearts cheesy i say
and he would drag out the last line of the song forever then leave out the first few words and repeat it then the rest and repeat it a few more times so finally we are just holding out the last note forever
annoying I started coming late to avoid choir practice
-they say,"everyone raise your hands"
-prays the words of the songs (above)
-after worship tells me to greet 5 or 6 people I didn't come with. (happens every time) Come on, are you kidding me???
-starts service late
-transitions between songs take long time
-doesn't know the words of the song
Am I the only person in the world who hates this song?
-mini sermons (sometimes not so mini) between songs
-assumes you're only worshipping if you're raising your hands and such - that's not how everyone is wired
-can't sing very well
-asks how everyone is doing. we're not at a concert, so we're not going to scream...
One more thing....Those of you who dislike being asked to shake hands with others around you, please explain this to me. It's one of my favorite parts of every Sunday, hoping I'll shake the hand of someone there for the first time, to make them feel at home and want to come back.
Worship interruptus…
Worship is really good, like a warm shower…you are all lathered up and enjoying the warm water…then POW!
Someone flushes the toilet and you get hit with COLD water…
Worship leaders stop talking so much…
Every now and again when truly lead by the spirit, but every other song, every week…
I chose to share the shower analogy - but there is also a “sex” analogy…
As far as the rest of these comments... did someone actually say they HATE the song "How Great is Our God?" yeah, that may be an indication of your heart's condition. I obviously must just need clarification on that one, as I can't see any reason to hate a song extolling God's greatness.
And regarding shaking people's hands at church... that is a part of the worship service to remind us that we are corporately worshiping, and not just by ourselves. In western culture, where individualism reigns, it's no wonder we dislike that part so much. And I am with you... i dislike it as well. But I use that discomfort to remind me that community is not easy or fun all the time, and that I need others with me to encourage me to worship.
In other words... I hate the "raise your hands"... "now, turn to your friend and say this". If at least they threw a couple of "now turn to your right and give your neighbor a french kiss... now to the the one on your left" huahuauhauha
2. When you can hear the "blue hairs" griping in the back of the sanctuary about what so-and-so is wearing and how it's not appropriate and how "someone should talk to that little girl".
3. After the first couple of songs that everyone sings together (with 4 part harmony) then, the next song that is picked is something that's supposed to be done by a quartet (all 4 parts sing different melodies during the chorus). It all just falls apart.
4. Those little "blue hairs" and the candy wrappers. Crinkle, crinkle, crinkle, crinkle..........
Just get the stupid piece of candy out, cram it in your face and put the stupid wrapper away!!!!
Sorry. I know this is long, but I've been in church all my life. This is just the stuff that's happened in the last 10 years. =)
I also think there should be no more than one interruption per worship set and by that, I'm referring to "sharing". I recently attended a VERY large church and hated their worship flow:
Song 1
(Pastor greeting)
Song 2
(Worship pastor greeting)
Song 3
(Worship pastor sharing)
Song 4
(Closing prayer)
Do anyone even know what "flow" is???
when they can't talk or pray appropriately between songs, connecting the songs to the sermon or theme of the day...
when they perform rather than worship themselves - authentic worship of God from the leader will overcome most all other faults or messups...
1. Mini Sermons between songs- many have mentioned this, but it drives me nuts and it is a big momentum killer. It goes from focusing on God to focusing on the leader, no matter what they say.
2. Using the song name as an introduction/transition - "You know I was thinking about how much God has done for me...it really is 'Amazing Grace' isn't it?"
3. Giving the congregation too much instruction, especially if it's personally driven. I want you to do this...I want you to do that. It's not about what YOU want!
4. Showing 0 (zero) emotion, standing still, focusing too much on perfection. We have a few that are like statues, they talk and sing about their love for Christ, but you could never see it in their body language!
I spent a year in a third-world country where *I* was the worship leader for our whole ministry. I have no voice, so-so guitar skills... oh, and we sang in four languages between us.
If you had been there, you would never, ever criticize any other 'worship leader' or 'lead worshiper' again!
:0)
Just to clarify that I do not hate the sentiment of the song, merely the melody -> my tongue was firmly in my cheek.
Have a good day
i was little uncomfortable with the topic at first. we all have things that tick us off to various degrees (and i tend to share some of the above), but ultimately, we are responsible for our own worship (through song, word, thought, service, deed, etc.)...
Go easy on those worship leaders...most of them are trying their best and learning what worship is, and how to worship, as they lead. Learning to truly worship God is an ongoing life lesson (see King David). Most of it is "on the job training".
I'd say my personal hang up is when worship leaders or worship pastors forget about the latter part of their title
- When they repeat the same catch-phrases EVERY WEEK
- When they pray essentially the same prayer as a transition moment.
For instance:
A couple of weeks ago, at the church service I attended, the sermon was about the different ways that people come to know Jesus (through logic, through crisis,and something else).
Well, after the preacher preached, the worship leader got back up, sang a song, and then went into this little soliloquy:
"It's amazing the way that Jesus leads people to himself. I know for me it was crisis. Well, crisis and some other things, but I can't remember what those were."
WHAT? You tell the whole congregation that there were "other things" that led you to accept Christ, but you can't remember what they were? (I actually laughed out loud when he said that. I almost felt bad.)
Geez, stick to singing bad music.
Sometimes things will try and bother me, and it’s at that point I can let it bother me, or believe the best of them. It helps me to tell myself, “I am going to believe they are being led by the Spirit to encourage the congregation to raise their hands, and sing, or that that “mini sermon” was a prompting of the Spirit.”
Let’s think about it. If we begin to get distracted or offended by something the worship leader does, or anything else in church for that matter, is the enemy getting what he wants? You bet. You’re being distracted from worship God Almighty. You’re being distracted from getting into better relationship with God.
And getting bugged or distracted is a choice. :)
I think these ‘pet peeves’ are optional. You can let them bug ya, or choose not to. A leader cannot please everyone. If they do stuff for their own edification or glorification, then shame on them.
8)
@ amoslanka - i heartily agree with you! "more stage lights stage front and center, please. turn up my guitar and voice in the house! the rest can bask in the reflection of light off me - like the moon reflecting the glorious light of the sun."
this is when the "leader" has elevated himself/herself into a place they have no right to be in, yeah?
But something that really bothers me is that church members don't think that he really does anything all week when he is sitting in his office. I can only speak for my husband, not for others, but he puts his heart and soul into planning the music week in and week out. From picking the songs to be sung each week by the choir, to also deciding what the congregation will sing. And church members get in the way of God with their own personal agendas. At the moment my husband can only pick songs from the hymnal because some in our church don't like to sing anything unless it is in the hymnal.
So while it is valid for the worship leader to ask for feedback from people, what we all need to realize is that the person called to lead worship at our church is just that, CALLED by GOD, just like the Pastor.
Thanks for this post. I just wrote one on worship. It's called 'when God takes over the service.'
Oh and i hate it when you have a decent sounding worship team only because you have one amazing instrumentalist. Than there's a 5.53 minute solo for that one person in every song. seriously, it's not about that.
--ash
talk-singing is awkward. worship leaders will be telling a story, sharing from the heart, and then the second half of their sentence just happens to be a line in the song and then... whoosh! we're singing.
the second thing i dislike, though incredibly funny, is when they sound seductive. "mmm... Jesus..." they say it like it's marvin gaye playing in the background, instead of the worship band.
As far as the whole "This is not a concert" comment. You are right. Sunday morning worship is not a concert, it is even better. At concerts we cheer and jump and raise our hands for mere humans and songs that we like. At church we jump, cheer and raise our hands (if you're into that kinda stuff) for the king of kings, the God who created us and the one who gave his life for us! To say that a worship leader shouldn't say things like "how you guys feelin today?" to engage the crowd is just preposterous!
Brittney brings up an interesting point about the I\we focus. As a worship leader it is very challenging to find songs that DON'T do this. While I don't think it is a bad thing from time to time too much may pull us in the wrong direction that you mention. Of course, it's not just the current "contemporary" songs that do this. Many of the most popular hymns do this as well: Amazing grace how sweet the sound that saved a wretch like ME; When I survey the wondrous cross; On Christ the solid rock I stand; The verses of How Great Thou Art, and on and on.
We have to remember that we have been given the beauty of a personal relationship with God by the sacrifice that was made on our behalf through Jesus Christ. Because of that sacrifice we can thank him for what he has done done in OUR lives. The key is that we also ensure that we also take the time to ensure that we do extol and praise God for who he is and for what he's done.
Carlos, thanks for starting this - I agree with the others who have said I would love to see a follow-up that talks about what people LIKE that the worship leader does.
And from a worship team musician's standpoint: When the pastor/leader improvises some song that he made up on the spot or a song that no one knows and he doesn't share it with the team ahead of time. Gah!!
I went to a Christian university and the new worship director during the middle of a song randomly asked that everyone get down on their knees. Two things you must understand:
1)This venue had theater-like seats and concrete floors so if you did kneel, you were crushed against a seat;
2)I was sitting with a professor who I loved (she was like my mom away from home) who was recovering from chemo and she could barely stand.
Needless to say we stood...we were the only ones and that worship leader made us feel like we were "ungodly" because she physically couldn't kneel.
On the other hand, I saw a professor who brought in a fabulous woodwind ensemble to lead worship only to see half the audience leave in a huff saying, "Well, this is dumb. It's so boring," as if the service was designed to praise them! Grrrr!!!
Hate is too strong a word for what I feel but in terms of wishing that things were different sometimes:
- When they hold back because they are obviously conscious of what the congregation and/or pastor will think.
- When they give a rip about the congregation period. I know there will always be that tension between bringing the congregation along and genuinely worshipping themselves... but for those rare moments when the leader has entered into His Presence and all else (including the rest of us) has fallen away... don't you worry about me... I'll be hot on your heels into the throne room. I think there is an underlying dynamic that is sometimes counter-intuitive to some worship leaders... we'll go if YOU go... but if all you do is LEAD then by definition we'll always be behind you instead of with you. So forget about us... that's what will truly give us a sense of release, freedom, permission even. And most won't go any deeper into His Presence than how far they intuitively feel the leader has given them permission.
- Also typos on the powerpoint (though at our church that's not the worship leader's fault). Once it said Calgary instead of Calvary... which is really funny if you're Canadian.
I've been on both sides of the stage and have backed down recently significantly from any position in leading worship at church. It started to break my heart in how far we've come from what it truly is... and what we've made it to be.
I've personally experienced worship more out of the four walls of a church then in them. And I'd rather assess where we are and how to better the worship within the four walls then criticize - because you'll always, always find something you don't like wherever you are.
Yeah, I don't like most of the "worship music" that I hear - and how in the world did it become its own genre? There seems to be one consistent sound produced, and I miss the excellence in music that we should be worshipping God with.
...and I will agree with some of you - the entire service on a Sunday morning is ALL worship. I talked to a young girl recently who asked me, literally, what "praise and worship" was. Music is only one part of worship. And worship doesn't end when the service ends, either, it's way of life. It's continual. It's about community (common unity?).
I'm ready to see the body alive to its fullest again - living, breathing, bleeding, active. I miss it.
I guess this long comment really didn't answer the question? : )
For those of you that have never met a dominican person before we are known to learn how to dance merengue before we learn how to walk.
What does this mean that our worship leaders assume that everybody wants to dance everytime when there is a song playing , they dont ask you to dance its like they demand it.
Just like Amy Storms , they can seem to think that everybody is in highschool and are begging to hear you scream/ yell / shout louder.
All this and the mini 4 mins sermons after everyother song . ughhhhhh
I actually heard a worship leader say once in Costa Rica,"if you dont dance for God your not going to heaven "
Seriously
Or when he/she doesn't get that just because a person isn't raising their hands or dancing or singing or clapping or "pumping their fists" doesn't mean that they are not worshiping and doesn't mean that God isn't working on them.
-has to remind Christians that corporate worship is a mandate from God.
-has to risk being a cheerleader because the people that claim to love God exhibit no sense of joy when singing about Him.
-has to burn the first song because 75% of the congregation is late, talking in the lobby, perfecting their coffee, or sleep walking instead of enthusiastically taking advantage of celebrating our Savior with like-hearted people.
-has to endure darts of personal preference from hundreds of individuals who have lost sight of what Sunday worship time is prescribed by God to be.
-is treated as a thoughtless hire rather than a divinely appointed servant.
-is expected to never get nervous but be humble,
execute notes and lyrics without flaw while avoiding performance and being vulnerable,
make no effort to teach or guide but don't be a juke box, and stay traditional and contemporary,
all while burying, birthing and resurrecting songs appropriately.
I'm sure that's easy to do!
-sing theologically incorrect lyrics
-talk in a creepy, soft voice
-make facial gestures that look like they are... well, you know
-use wireless, headset mics (ala Britney)
-don't play an instrument
-call what they are doing "worship"
-act like rock stars
-name drop
-ruin perfectly good songs
-preach that "worship isn't JUST music ya know" but then act like it with everything else they do
-have a blog (just kidding) :)
When we come to worship we all share in a mutual responsibility. Do you know what I've observed after standing on the stage leading others for more than 22 years? We have the best worship when the church worships. Period. PErfection, new songs, great worship leader - all of these are extras. When we are focused passionately on God, we have great worship. One guitar or a full band, this is the recipe.
I know there are skills needed to lead more effectively. I work on that continually. PRAY for your worship leader!
Also, an open mike doesn't give license (or credentials) to preach. Mini-sermons take the focus off of God on puts it on us.
I want to be LED in a worship of the Almighty. There are many gifted musicians whom I wouldn't follow to the church kitchen. But the musician who has a deep spiritual walk I'll follow anywhere. His walk always shows through and with him we sing glorious praises to THE KING.
I hope I dont lead (do what God has called me to do) around some of you. Were being honest right?
Its pretty hard already having the responsibility to lead unimpressed people in worship.
Pleaser re-read the blog post title and content. Carlos didn't ask us to criticize /worship/. He specifically asked what we hate our worship leaders doing. If we presume that all of us love to worship God through song and other avenues, then the things we don't like our worship leaders doing are probably things that are barriers to us connecting with God through worship while under their leadership.
This isn't about criticizing our worship leaders for the sake of criticism. It's about constructive feedback for the sake of better leadership.
I haven't actually seen a single commenter attack worship itself.
I am not a worship leader, but if I was I would love this blog post because I would want to do my best to remove myself as a barrier between the worshiper and the worshipped. And this would give me valuable insight that most people would probably never tell me to my face.
peace|dewde
http://dewde.com
Anon- Says:
July 15th, 2008 at 3:58 am
-they tell you what line is next even though its already on the screen
This is my biggest pet peeve. when they mumble out at lightning fast pace the whole next line right before they sing those same exact words. Not sure how this trend got started but it really interrupts and distracts me as I am worshipping God.
My mind is fragile. I know this.
peace|dewde
http://dewde.com
You know what our pastor says "Well, we aren't worshipping you...we are worshipping God". AND GUESS WHAT!?!? We are having revival in our worship. True revival with people running to the front of the altar with tears streaming down their faces.
Man, we shouldn't be hating on our worship leaders...worship leaders hear this criticism in their own churches week in and week out - I guarantee you. They hear the "constuctive criticism". People criticizing worship and worship leaders has become a plague.
A worship pastor telling the people to lift their hands or shout out is biblical and just what the church needs...the congregation needs to shout at the same time so the walls will come down - a congregation unified in worship is so POWERFUL. Worship leaders are there to SHOW you how to worship..that's their job. Hopefully our churches are filled with first timers that don't know how to worship or what to do.
...whatever
Like Jan, I've been around for a while (I'm also 42). I think that Los' question comes from a good place. Essentially, he is asking what roadblocks to worship leaders put between you and God (without knowing it).
I also get that Los' wording invites the kinds of comments that I've just got done reading through.
Based on the some of comments, it seems to me that worship consumerism is alive and well for those commenters. Worship for YOU is about making YOU feel good and about giving YOU a good experience and what needs YOU are getting met (or not getting met).
Unfortunately, that's not what CORPORATE worship is about. Simply put, it ain't about you.
I appreciate what Rick said: "has to endure darts of personal preference from hundreds of individuals who have lost sight of what Sunday worship time is prescribed by God to be."
Also what Some Guy said: "Its pretty hard already having the responsibility to lead unimpressed people in worship."
It's true, your worship leader isn't perfect. And they should constantly be working on their craft. And they need to be lovingly told if there are things that they do that are a distraction for the entire congregation.
So be an agent of change. Pray for them. Pray for yourself. Ask God to help you get over it or show you if your issue is something that you should address with the worship leader or not. If so, do it in love. If not, God may be using them to help you grow.
I guess that was a little more than $0.02.
-He doesn't read charts...real charts
-Forgets to move his capo thus making the band look band
-Can't get enough of his guitar in the monitor
-Is late
As far as "How Great Is Our God" goes: it needs to be shelved with the other overplayed songs in the past. Do something unique and don't do that song as the "go to" or "closer" for every service.
Just a thought
Thx man.
@JudiFree:
Please consider that the commenters on this blog are very likely not those same people whom you are talking about. First of all the Internet provides a blanket of anonymity so that the quiet or shy types can have a voice. Also, the demographic of this blog probably favors worship leaders since Carlos is one. So if anything, based on demographics, we could be reading a watered down version of what congregations *really* think.
peace|dewde
http://dewde.com
Lead. Explain the songs. Pray. Whatever. But don't preach, and keep the monologue short. People lose interest quicker than you think when they are standing up.
Start there. Forget the rules.
As far as the question goes,
Have no flow
pick some song that is so wordy that I don't even get the meaning
definitley say the words right before they sing them. We can read.
close there eyes, there is a line to be drawn, but if you really expect the worship leader to worship, while he is leading everyone else in worship(if that makes sense), and that is how he does it, then let him do it.
but it does kinda bug me when people pray the words of the songs too. thats so cheating
i actually think it's all kind of funny and it makes us real people. truth be told we all need to be thinking about some of these things so that we can be more aware of who we are when we're leading.
my aim, as much as possible, is to strive to lead in my worship on stage the same way i'd lead my 'life' of worship off stage. but, i'm the first guy to take some tips from peeps that are doing it well and put on my matt redman 'arrr' vs. 'awe' in 'Let My Words Be Few' - HAHAH!
maybe more of my issue with Worship Leaders is when we all become so cynical that we forget to see ourselves in 'all of the above' (no pun intended - circa United 2007) and this is true especially as it relates to us being people that respond with the same passion when our Worship Leader hat is off and we just get to be in the crowd, as a normal person, engaging. there's NOTHING more annoying to me than a charismatic Worship Leader on stage and seeing them in a gathering when they're stage hat is off and they're the most cynical, unresponsive, un-leader like worshipper in the crowd.
DO YA FEEL ME ON THiS STUFF?!?!
brianwurzell.wordpress.com
as long as they keep it about Jesus and not themselves- why should i gripe?
we're having a great time. we're a team of Worship Leaders that are growing and always talking. i hope to getting connected here to the blog world a bit more...i've not been a blogger until this past weekend. i'll try and get some video up on my blog of what we're doing here in AZ very soon.
my goal is to 'outblog' carlos. hahahah. a wishful thought, but, you know how the North Point Church crew is they're into a little competition, they know they're the deal. hahaha! ONLY KIDDING for those of you who are taking me seriously -i'm not really going to compete with CARLOS. CARLOS: me/you a praise-filled (east to west) boxing match. come on now!
the comment by BB, “Leading worship is the art of removing distractions” kinda sticks out as what I think a worship leader ought to strive for -- it's a *HARD* balance between presenting perfection for the congregation and being honest with your offering through singing to God.
1) Telling us the first few lines of the next verse een though they are on the screen every time
2) Fist pumping (or anything that has him/her stop playing the guitar). If the rest of the band can keep their hands on whatever they are playing, you don't get a pass to stop playing for 30 seconds while you randomly pump your fist in the air.
I now view these types of prompts from song leaders as opportunities to obey the authorities that God has put in place over my life, in this case...my song leader at my local church.
I really think worship is not for our own entertainment. Worship leaders/directors/pastors get a bad rap. People need to stop scrutinizing them so much. It's sometimes the same people over and over again who complain. It's almost as though they look for something wrong every week instead of actually worshiping God.
Now I'm not saying that if there is a legitimate concern you shouldn't voice it. Absolutely you should, but you should really look at where your heart is before you say something. Please remember that your worship pastor is human and not perfect.
I guess I'll add something on why worship leaders might talk - maybe it will help you understand from at least one worship leaders perspective. For me, I am considered the Worship Pastor at my church. It is my role and job to teach, lead, instruct not just the band but the congregation. I have a congregation full of people who had never been taught to worship. never. they had no idea what we were doing. I personally just am not interested in having people do a sing a long. I am NOT a song director. That is not what God called me to do. I want to see people worship God! Well, they must be taught. So worship is a lab, a learning experience if you will. In that time I not only at times direct, but I must teach. Why do we raise our hands, why would we bow, what is confession, what is praise or worship for that matter. All that and more are my responsibility to teach my church. In 10 years we've done one series on worship. We are in an interim time now, but my pastor did not teach on worship, nor did he really model it. But every week I have 25 minutes to teach my congregation to worship. And no matter what we might think, worship is not the flu, we don't just catch it. Having said all that, I do not say anything unless I have something REAL to say. That's the advice I give all worship leaders I am working with. So I don't do it each week. But if I do, there's a reason why.
BTW, I don't particularly care to be told what to do in worship either. But, many times God has spoken to me when I have done something I really was resistant to. When I let go of my pride, God moved. Just sayin.....
worship leaders who seem really wrapped up in being "cool"
worship that seems like a performance
posts like this elicit nearly 120 comments in a little over 12 hours. One of the things that seriously concerns me about my generation (20-30) is how quickly we can voice our displeasure over something. But if you ask us to voice something positive, the thoughts don't flow quite as fast.
I bet if Los started a thread entitled "I Love it when my Worship Leader..." it wouldn't get 120 comments in the same amount of time. It might not get that many period!
BTW: I think this is a great conversation to have. It just bothers me how quickly we can point out what we don't like in others.
As much as I love the music, I really don't like the concert feel at our church sometimes, when the music and band are so loud that you can't hear those around you singing. I think the band, worship leaders and congregation should be singing together...... instead of the congregation being drowned out by the band/musicians/singers. Worship should be corporate..... for it's "worship" not a concert.
Is Brandon right? Is that a challenge? I think the word "hate" ellicits passion and that's why there has been a big response. Would you go on to balance this out and ask "I LOVE it when my Worship Leader....."?
PS. I totally agree with the typos on the screen too AND when they don't capitalize "He" or "Him" when talking about God.
And the thing about shaking hands with others...I don't know about any other church, but at our church, that is one of the only ways that new people can get connected to established people. We don't have Sunday School for adults and we have very few life groups (or whatever you call them) for people to get involved in...so how exactly are new people supposed to become part of the community without that?
- singing off key...if you can't sing, it's a distraction and you're in the wrong occupation.
- being able to go with the flow, but knowing when to stop and move on. thats the leader part of it!
Secondly, it's the easiest thing in the world to be one of those bitter, complaining types that sit and point fingers but never give God what he deserves because they're too wrapped up in their frustration that they can't get beyond it to the real reason we worship - GOD!
Finally, I think besides all that, this is good. Worship leaders need challenging sometimes - but not abuse... and congregational members sometimes need challenging too to get past their 'my worship leader isn't "King of Worship" David and actually realise how well they connect with God is mostly on their shoulders.
Worship leaders lead your desire to connect and worship God - if you've got no desire then they can't lead you.
Do we really count these annoyances in the same catagory as people trafficking or rape? Really?
As a member of a church, a worship leader, a drummer and several other things, I dislike it when people harbour such annoyances without either giving them up and and getting a life, or dealing with them (like grownups do.)
I have no problem with sung worship and praise, but I'm a bigger fan of living worship in the rest of my life.
I will sing with all my soul!" If we can all come to church and sing with all our soul everything else will fall into place. And what a great worship experience that would be.
i am a worship leader. if i heard christians at my church having this conversation, i would tell them to go to a different church and leave seats for people who actually want to sing a song to God with me. or even better, for people who don't yet know Jesus. i would also ask them to leave for the bad example they are to the people just learning about God.
i do what i do because i feel called to do it, not to get famous or get rich or be in the lime light... and i will whole heartedly agree that sometimes it's hard to come up with an authentic prayer 5 services in a row weekend after weekend and i have sometimes used words from the song or whatever... i've also forgotten words, made mistakes, adjusted my equipment... i've done it all. i'm not saying it's right, but what i am saying is that this conversation does nothing but destroy the community that is our church. and as for the mistakes i make, i watch back each service i lead to eliminate these things as much as possible, as they do serve to distract people from what we're really there for.
to the people here who've portrayed nothing but a consumeristic, judgmental attitude; you are the Christians that the rest of the world hates! why don't you take that negative energy and use it to encourage people around you to strive and grow and serve and worship. we are all worship leaders. instead of criticizing your leaders on some blog, you should encourage them with constructive comments.
Also, as far as typos go, yes they are annoying, but I think they go in the "everyone is human" category. We lackeys charged with input usually check and double check that stuff and it still gets through only to be noticed while its up there Sunday morning. Talk about sweaty palms. Do you know who that person is at your church? I can almost guarantee they would appreciate a hug and a "thank you".
As far as the "handshake" portion of the worship goes, I don't think anyone is against people being warmly greeted by someone during church. But the 30 seconds of "quick, shake as many hands as you can!" doesn't ever really feel authentic or warm (to me, at least).
Also, after all of the EQ, they grab a different mic.
Also, Ancient of Days. I'm sorry. That song should forever be retired.
But what I do hate is when the WL BADGERS the congregation by making them feel guilty when they're not as enthusiastic as they'd want them to be. My old church was good for this. They'd just scream at the top of their lungs: "COME ON!!! YOU CAN DO BETTER THAN THAT! DON'T JUST STAND THERE AND GIVE GOD A PITTY PAT PRAISE! HE'S BEEN TOO GOOD TO YOU!!" and all that. It feels kind of abusive sometimes. Give it a rest. Just go ahead and worship God. Passion is contagious. They'll catch on.
Oh man, we are so far away from what worship really is. I'd go with what biscuet says.
And for us worship leaders - it is not and will never be about us! So let's stop drawing attention to ourselves!
On the other hand there's nothing more frustrating as worship leader than trying in all you do to paint a bigger God and no-one in the congregation responds.
This is all great discussion. But if we do not ask God to heal us of our greed and discontent, Satan will be pleased again. So, talk with your LEADERS, in love and mercy. Discuss and pray with them. Then, if you are not already doing it, pray that God will remove the consumer-selfish logs from our hearts before we enter the Sanctuary. For that matter, before we get out of bed each morning. For I am sure if we are so discontent with all of the above, that there are many other judgmental parts of our lives.
By all means, I have been in the same place as most of you. This is as much for me as the rest. This is not to judge, just hoping we can continue to use every breath God gives us, to glorify Him.
Thanks Los for the stirring!
Stir it up...keep it fresh.
Change up the arrangements once in a while. :)
all of the above...in one place of my heart would make me fearful and self conscious...especially since i just lead worhsip this past sunday - thanks Carlos ;)
But the other part of me...the "in my weakness He is strong" part stirrs in me a deeper passion to continue leading ever more realizing how important it is that people connect with Jesus...not me...though i am the messenger...
obviously some get it and some wont...Not going to allow the "wonts" to play the Holy Spirit's role in my life and be the voices i hear when I'm leading...
But still...my resolve...we have to connect people to Jesus - wherever it is we're at in the "growing" curve as a worship leader...as a FAN of God, singing, messing up, doing great, struggling, forgettin words, talking to much, saying to little, to tired, to excited...ALL in an effort to make HIM famous...trusting that without HIS SPIRIT....doesnt matter anyways.
what we get to do is AWESOME and humbling and when God is moving...it's the greatest seat in the house - be it a difficult one at times or effortless at others....and sure its easy to judge when your not doing it...but man....i'm excited to lead worship again this sunday!
1. Be encouraged worship leaders - keep connecting with God FIRST - dont spend more time reading this blog and let these comments speak louder to you then the words of God! ( i know its tempting) Lead this coming sunday with a fresh heart and desire to live those lyrics out...Sing with passion and excellence, keep taking voice lessons, write songs, learn how to dance a little maybe...go home and be the same person...love your families and TRUST that HIS SPIRIT will allow you to be effective and will do what you could Never do on your own or be good enough to accomplish -no matter how much you tried. He will use you in an INCREDIBLE way that you may Never hear about!!!
2. Be encouraged church attender...You matter to us...we are crazy excited you came..be it first time or last time...and we are trusting that "Greater is He that is in us...then He that is in the world"..."His glory goes beyond all fame"...and if the message we send is REAL...were praying you'll connect with Jesus inspite of us...
Pursue Jesus...connect with Him no matter where your WL is at in the process. You will stand before GOD one day...not your worship leader...so be ready to give an account of your LIFE'S worship that doesnt involve your particular worship leader...and we are excited about that!
CASE
Therein lies the rub for me. Your worship leaders are humans...fallen...far from perfect. They want to lead the church in worship but have the various stressors of time, style, the pastor, congregation (and the list could go on) all to think about and around within the short timeframe of 15 minutes...or so.
If you're a worship leader who's just experienced and learned from those things that are 'gripes' for other people, then this is a great learning post for you, and it is for me as well. If you're one posting, especially the frustrations (and there are going to be some with EVERYONE who's on a platform, whether worship leader or pastor), consider the humanity behind the person we're critiquing.
For those who don't understand musicians, we have something we deal with called perfectionism...we want things to be the best they could be. It's a blessing and a curse. It drives us to be better, but sometimes it goes over the top. The thing about it all is that we take things very personally as well. The songs you sing for 15 minutes we pour over for hours both in prayer and preparation. Just some thoughts for your consideration.
Thanks to all the posts though. They've been helpful and good reminders (most of them anyway :-)
No more defensive postures Worship Leaders...whoever you are...
keep your head up....
when you read this eventually and you will....be cool...just breath!
C'mon people. Love Jesus and be happy.
-wears crotch hugging jeans
seems to me a lot of so-called worship leaders are just discontented American Idol wannabees who aren't good enough to sell their records in the mainstream so have to settle for a built in audience every week in their own little arena.
in the word's of Rick Warren, "it's not about you."
Providing song list at last minute and expecting to be able to master songs (often a few new ones) in a day or two. If you're full time this could be done but when you have a job too ... it's tuff!!
maybe i dont know what im talking about. still learning. ha
Los, when do worship leaders get to comment on "I hate when the congregation gripes about..."?
Worship leaders are just musicians on a stage. If they "botch" it for you, then you aren't worshipping.
What a SAD, SAD, SAD state the church is in when we have blogs up about "I hate it when my worship leader".
You know what? I HATE it when people die without Jesus, people at my work, people at starbucks, and even people at my church.
How's about we fulfill the great commission and stop bitching about petty stuff on a pointless blog.
Go read your Bibles and find out what worship means, because it has nothing to do with music.
Sam L leads worship with his eyes closed because if he doesn't, he will see me holding up signs in the audience that say "Show me your boobs"
I'm not going to talk about styles, different styles work for different congregations.
I don't mind some talking between songs, as long as it is tasteful and well placed. I've seen it go too far the other way, no talking at all; this wasn't a good balance either.
I don't like when the worship leader surprises the band with a new song (or several) on Sunday. This lack of preparation tears down the band, and isn't healthy. God is in the planning.
I don't like when so many rules and restrictions are placed on the worship leader. "only sing hymns", "only sing chorus's", etc. All the restrictions make for a very forced, and unfree worship time.
I don't like when worship is interrupted for announcements, or other similar things. You lose all the momentum
I'm not a fan of when the prayer telegraphs the theme of the next song...
"God you are amazing" - begin singing "amazed".
I'm not a worship leader (I work in production) and WL's have a tough job. They deserve our support.
Lastly, as many others here have stated, worship is not about us.
and Brian Foster Kane - go sit in the teen section and you'll see all the boobs you want. come on parents - cover up those boobs on yer kids.
To answer your questions:
I am here because a "Worship Leader" friend of mine asked me to check out this belligerent discussion on a pointless and fruitless topic about something a worship leader does that "ruins it for you". I never claimed to have it all figured out...I just know that if Jesus were wanting Christians to create blogs, it would not be for the purposes of soliciting complaints about people that God has called to bring music and anointing into His house.
If this blog were a table...it is my opinion that Jesus would have turned it upside down.
"Go hang out with all the other ones who have it figured out"??? What does that even mean? I hang out with people that DON'T have it figured out, because the ones who claim to have it all figured out are usually the ones who make blog postings like this.
Unfortunately, some of my "worship leader" friends read some of the comments on here and were weighed down and made insecure by the forthright knowledge of the critical spectators that make up your church-going audience.
It's websites like this and responses like yours that make countless amounts of people I know want to stay as far away from Christianity as they can because "all Christians do is eat their young and wounded".
I'm sorry if I wasted precious space on this site, but I am just so tired of people picking apart other people that lead worship or minister. If the worship leader bothers you and doesn't fulfill the "entertainment" needs that you have...then go watch 27 Dresses in IMAX if you want to be entertained in a matter that is perfect. (Kathryn being perfect...mind you).
If you are a normal "reader" of this blog...I plead with you to not post any more comments about your dissatisfaction with your "worship leader", they do what they can and they are not perfect...but bitching about them will only discourage them and not cause them to turn into the princes you desire them to be.
Although this post and thought provoking question may at first come across as demeaning and destructive, did you ever think that the motive behind it was for reasons completely different. If you read up a little bit, it seems that Toby, after reading all of the negative responses, has had a change of heart. He realized that worship is worship and it's not for us, but God. Maybe this post is for people to turn around and realize that they've turned worship into a prodcution. A production that they are the director of, and if they're not happy then things go terribly wrong.
I may be the only one to see it like this, but just a thought.
Thanks for your response. Although you may disagree with me, I appreciate the way you have gone about it. I did think about the motives being completely different, and I didn't have enough time to read all of the comments on this page, but I did read a majority of them. I am pleased to hear that Toby has had a change of heart, however, I still feel that beginning a discussion on the internet about this topic is more harmful than it is good. For every Toby there is that has a change of heart from this, there are a lot more people offended by this.
It is my opinion that the most adult, Godly thing we could do in this type of a situation is to go to that Worship Leader directly and share your thoughts and feelings with them personally. I know from being a former Worship Leader myself, that would have been a discussion I would have liked to have, but reading stuff like this online would have only caused division.
To quote an email I got from a friend last night (regarding this topic on this blog), "Dude, I am paranoid to get up on Sunday after reading all of this stuff. What if some of those people go to my church? I know people can be judgemental, but this is flat out picky. No can do it right and we try the hardest we can, but again the church tells us it's not good enough. This is why worship leaders last an average of 2 years at a church."
I am all about starting discussions, but not providing an open forum simply for people to complain. How sad is it that the "I hate it" post has over 100 more comments than the "I love it" post.
There is always a reason behind the reason...maybe just to show us He is in control and not me, Los or any of the rest of us.
Give us your authentic view please. :)
This post has been more real than most are comfortable with.
It sucks to know what people are really thinking.
So I am all for these kind of posts.
And when people start calling other people names...
Well that discredits them right away.
Thanks Michael.
Truth will set you free.
Bottom line, Los, and everyone else....if a non-believer were to stumble across this website and read this list of complaints....what do you think they would say?
"All Christians do is bitch and moan about each other"? I think so.
But I guess the Bible was right when it says "they will know we are Christians by the way we constantly spew petty bullshit at each other and point out flaws."
Blessings!
-BFK
P.S. Los, sorry about the Daughtry comment, it was more of a compliment than it was "name calling".
Can we pick on something else now, like sermons?
It reminds me of the suggestion wall at Whole Foods Market. There is a wall...you write on a piece of paper and instead of putting it in a box, you post it to the board. Now, for a business this seems very savvy...it says the to consumer, "Let us hear your petty likes and dislikes, we are here for you."
I'm not bashing Los for asking the question, but I am taken aback at the sheer consumerism that is dripping from these responses. They are laundry lists of likes and dislikes. This is fine for a store, where you become a patron and shop because of the experience or value it contains, but for a service of believers coming together to corporately tell our Savior how we love and adore Him, praising Him, thanking Him for who He is and swearing to lift Him up in good times and bad, it makes me ill.
Are we so focused on our own wants...our own perceived needs? Now, I agree that there are certain things leaders to that can be annoying...and the stories are funny, but I don't understand some of the folks saying things like,
-we hate greeting people (seriously? Why are you even here?)
-we hate slow/fast/new/old/dense/lite songs (Do you remember the songs last week? Is your guy/gal changing it up)
-we hate mini-sermons (well yeah...who doesn't)
I know I'm late to the discussion...been on vacation with no *Dun Dun Duhhh* internet access.
The music minister at our former church is immature, unprepared, lazy, unfocused, and incompetent at her job. But she is a very sweet, likable person.
Elizabeth's voice is high and rather shrill. All of the songs she choses are in her key, which is higher than most people's. She was asked to lower the key of the selections and to take voice lessons. She went to a couple lessons but stopped. Didn't lower the key either.
Her clothing choices were so bad, a board member's wife took her shopping. And, she got a great stylist to do her hair. She looked great for a couple of months. Elizabeth started showing up in mix-matched rumpled clothing and her hair looked like she just rolled out of bed. When asked about it, she said she just couldn't be bothered putting that much time into her appearance.
Elizabeth was sent to an intensive - and expensive - music conference halfway across the world. When she came back and was asked how it was, she said, "It was okay."
People were dropping like flies from the choir and the band, under Elizabeth's leadership. The pastor gave her several leadership books to read. A few months later, she was asked about the books. Elizabeth told her boss she never read them.
For 3 years, for Christmas/Easter productions, other people came up with the idea for the production, wrote, executed and produced them. Elizabeth, as worship director, got the credit. Last year, her best friend did the production. It was all over their MySpace pages.
Elizabeth was not fired. She was promoted.
When people make worship all about them and not about God.
And on the note of prayer transitions--I hate it when whoever does the prayer "sets up" the next song by using the title in the prayer (i.e. "Thank you God for being Mighty to Save...") even when it has nothing to do with anything else they've prayed...
Seriously, I'm not jumpin down anyones throat, I'm just curious as to what everyone here who threw in their 2 cents about their worship leader would do different if they had to lead peaple. Can we make that the blog topic and have the people who so graciousely chastized their worship leader through this forum come up with the perfect way to lead worship? Just a thought.
I was privileged once to be under the leadership of a guy whose heart was to see congregational led worship. He wanted to get rid of the stage, and let the people go to God themselves. Because that's how it will be in Heaven. No worship leaders or praise teams. Just a vast sea of grateful souls lifting up their voices in praise to Jesus.
So I think, since there is such unhappiness with the worship leaders, that maybe we should just do away with stages and music and praise teams. That way, there won't be ANY distractions and people can just worship God. Because I know that's what everyone is after right? No one on this forum is looking to be catered to or entertained right???
When did worship become about us? When did it become about our preferences and consumer wants? It just seems so self-serving. We cater to the audience's wants and if we satisfy them well enough then they will stay in our church, maybe bring friends, and "pay" us for our service via the tithe (you know what I mean).
I see so many people in churches trying to manipulate things towards their own preferences (I guess that is called, "influence" in most churches). Wink, wink. They don't do it for evil intent, it just happens. Then, we worship leaders get very frustrated about one thing...are we spending our time learning how to worship God better and be a better worship leader, or are we learning how to please our "base" more and satisfy our customers?
It has frustrated me to the point of considering leaving the ministry. Your thoughts?
I see a couple of valid Scriptural things here. One of them to be sure, is their walk not matching their talk. I think I would need to perhaps talk to the Pastor about this, and/or find a new church. The other might have to do with not being able to end a song, and I say that because it "could" be that person wants to stay up front longer, and cannot let go of the spot light.
Something that concerns me in the singing portion of the worship service, is that we don't know how to be quiet anymore. The music has to be at deafening decibel levels, and I am sorry, but I cannot hear the "still small voice of God" in all of that. Has anyone ever thought what a worship service would have been like in the first century, or what they are like in underground churches? I am convinced they are passionate in their worship, but they (the underground church) cannot afford to be loud. What would we do if we couldn't have all of our noise? Please do NOT misunderstand me, I LOVE music, and have been on a worship team in the past. I have just been wondering, with all of the distractions outside of the church, has our worship music become one of them? Not the leader, but the music. I have heard people say they cannot worship w/out music.
I am sorry, I will stop here. I know I have gone on too long already.
Now we've found another church that we dearly love. The worship leader is quite young and she has just started to learn to play. The pastor invited us to worship practice as they are a small church and are in need of help and, once again, the worship leader treated me very cold, to the point of pretty much ignoring that I was there (there were 4 people total...).
I'm not trying to take anyone's position. I've prayed and asked God for the right spirit, because I don't ever want a contentious spirit in my heart. As a leader and a musician at Vineyard churches, I learned to be open and enjoy the gifts God has given us. Unfortunately, the nearest Vineyard is many miles from here.
Our hearts are also in other worship (kindness ministries, nursing home ministries--there are many ways to worship God). So we are planning to do those things to help out the church we are attending.
I guess my pet peeve about worship leaders (I've just recently found this out) would be insecurity. Open your heart and let others help; it's not about us, anyway, it's about HIM! When we work together, abilities multiply and He is glorified!
When I was a worship leader I was under the authority of the pastor, and to my knowledge, that's the way it is supposed to be. Yes, I had a certain amount of freedom, but I did not have the freedom (or the want to) to make someone feel unwelcome.
But for now I will be happy doing other ministries...and those wonderful older folks in the nursing home will be more than happy to join in on some songs...
Let us hear from you, and give us some info about yourself or attach a resume'.
And this is typical of the guys I have met. They think they are God's gift, rather than realizing that all their gifts come from God and He can take them away and all the opportunity in an instant.
Leigh, I feel so badly about what is happening to you. I do not fit the stereotypical "young guy in t-shirt and jeans" either. Even though I play a contemporary style, my looks are deceiving (46 year old mom who is known to wear skirts to church). And even though the contemporary stuff is great, it's good to throw some of the hymns and older stuff in there now and then for the sake of the people who have been around a while.
They don't know what they are missing out on by selecting someone with maturity to fill in and maybe mix things up a bit! I'm not sure of your situation, but you know there are a lot of churches who really need good worship leaders, and age does not matter to them.
Also, I'm finding that the church is not the only place to play gospel music. There are coffee houses, fairs, etc. that would probably appreciate your talent, too!!!
Blessings to you and to your desire to continue to use your talent for HIM!
Brad