Ragamuffin Soul - Latest Comments in Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

WendyK — Mon, 08 Sep 2008 15:26:22 -0000

While I'm not downplaying the seriousness of this man's sin (lying), it's kind of sad to see so many Christians so quick to judge and condemn. What's really sad is that our (the church's) quick judgment likely contributed to his choice to invent a physical illness, rather than be honest and open about his spiritual illness. Is it possible (I think likely) that he felt he would only be accepted by Christians if he were physically dying, but would likely be rejected in telling the truth of his spiritual condition?

Lying is sin. No argument. While most have not done this on this magnitude and public scale, we have all sinned, and fall short. Yet we are so quick to judge, reject, and throw away.

This song, and this story, points to the healing that needs to take place within the church. We need mercy. We need grace. We need forgiveness. We need acceptance. We need reconciliation. Not only from Christ for our sins. But for each other for theirs.

Perhaps he felt the necessity to lie because too many in the church do not show mercy, grace, forgiveness, or acceptance for people bound in sexual and other sin. It is the dark stuff that we prefer to ignore, cover up, and then rant and rave when a public figure falls.

Amazing how so many are only willing to forgive after they have received a "sincere" apology. Yet, while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. It is that kindness that leads us to repentance.

Perhaps if we showed kindness, love, gentleness, mercy, grace, unconditional acceptance, then people, yes, even leaders, might feel more confident in sharing their real struggles.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

merritt — Sun, 07 Sep 2008 22:32:30 -0000

Some coworkers and I had a discussion about this when it first came out. We eventually reached the conclusion that even though it was born out of falsehood, the message- that God is our healer and all we need- is still very much true.

Also, while on a much larger scale, isn't this similar to most worship leaders when they stand in front of people and lead them in songs that may not be true in their own life?

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

jeremydgreat — Sun, 07 Sep 2008 17:03:43 -0000

@Josh- I think motives do matter. A lot.

If you were drowning in a river and I jumped in to save you, people would see this as a heroic act of benevolence. And rightly so. The end result is that you would be saved.

If you were drowning in a river and I jumped in to save you, only so that I could torture you, people would see this as an act of evil. And rightly so. The end result is that you would be saved. Just because someone stopped me from torturing you, doesn't change the act of saving you as an evil act.

In morality, it's not only the ends that matter. We should do the right thing not just because of some cold, calculated result... but because DOING the right thing IS right.

You see this in Jesus ALL the time. He's less concerned about the results of some action or law, and is more concerned with the heart of the person acting.

I guess what I'm saying is, I think in one important sense, Paul is wrong.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Josh Gurley — Sat, 06 Sep 2008 23:58:11 -0000

I love what Paul has to say about people's motives for preaching the Gospel.

Philippians Ch 1:

15It is true that some preach Christ out of envy and rivalry, but others out of goodwill. 16The latter do so in love, knowing that I am put here for the defense of the gospel. 17The former preach Christ out of selfish ambition, not sincerely, supposing that they can stir up trouble for me while I am in chains.18 But what does it matter? The important thing is that in every way, whether from false motives or true, Christ is preached. And because of this I rejoice.

Verse 18 is the is where the rubber meets the road for the "Healer" story, and more importantly for our attitude towards it... I love Paul's heart... even if it meant trouble for him... as long as the Gospel was preached.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

jenn lee — Sat, 06 Sep 2008 16:07:54 -0000

My heart breaks for him...but gives new meaning to the song "Healer". I, of course, always thought of the song from the perspective of someone needing healing from a terminal illness or physical problem in general. This song brings new meaning and freedom to all those that, along with Mike G., need God to be their healer of devastating addictions, emotional disease, and psychological battles. The song is still powerful, and I believe God will still use it to deliver people. Mike G.'s prayer was sincere, he just masked the place where he was crying out from with something that might be a little more acceptable and easier to swallow by the church. Mike, God is still your healer, and nothing is impossible for him...not even a life crippling addiction to porn!

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Mr. Police Man — Sat, 06 Sep 2008 04:30:10 -0000

I' ve look but could not find. I'd love to see Hillsongs reaction.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

DenOfThieves — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 22:31:06 -0000

Rachel - the song was written by a liar, a fake a and great deceiver. But your 'Pop Christianity' is disturbing.
You are easily deceived.

If Marilyn Manson had written the song would you feel different about it? or would you say 'God still works through imperfect people".
You would probably say it was blasphemy.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Dustin — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 18:48:46 -0000

The story seemed very condemning towards him because of his actions. I believe that he's in the same boat everyone else is in or has been in. Who hasn't tried to live two lives, hide things from those we care about, and try to deceive to avoid the truth of how imperfect we are? I don't hold any hostility, anger, or bitterness to him. He wrote an amazing song that is inspiring to thousands, maybe even millions of people. I think it's great that he is being helped and would like to see more support for him in his recovery.

Remember: in our weakness, He is made stronger.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Scott Overpeck — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 15:06:00 -0000

Verily verily I say to you, any man that speaketh from behind a unabomber beard, beleiveth not what comes from behind said beard, for it is the beard that distorts all truth into lies as it has forever been it shall for ever be.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Rachel — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 13:59:18 -0000

Does not in any way change the power of the song. God still works through imperfect people. The man definitely needs help, but He also needs grace. Who here among us is without guilt or shame? Who am I to cast judgement?

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Dean — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 12:46:05 -0000

He is just at the beginning of his journey and will have a completely different perspective about what he did and why he did it in a couple of years (if he chooses to stay close to God). Personally . . . I think him saying anything more than a simple apology publically was premature . . . it needed to happen but he needed to get some healing going in his life first.

Pretty much anything he says now can (and probably should be) taken with a grain of salt. We just need to give him grace and love him. God will work a miracle in his life (so long as Michael allows) and the journey before him really is just beginning. I know . . . I've been there.

The road ahead will not be easy. He may never realize his full potential that he was created for, but God still has a plan for Michael’s life. God still loves him. God knew from the foundation of time that Michael would have this sin in his life and STILL sent his Son to die for Michael anyway.

I hope and pray that God still has a plan for Michael to write music . . . he obviously has a gift.

Remember - we are only talking about him because he is caught. How many of us are walking around right now with sin in our lives and not handling with God or the folks around us? I'm sure not going to throw any stones . . .

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

sherry — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 12:08:04 -0000

praying for him and for all of us. Our actions have a ripple affect. The stone hit's the water, ripple! word are spoken, sound travels! Search my heart O lord make my path streight so my actions do not hurt you lord. say the the lords prayer.Amen. old school

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Chris Ames — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 12:00:30 -0000

Anyone who says, "From this day forward I am not lying anymore" clearly does not grasp the power of human nature or the gravity of what he has done. Ask any recovering substance or sex addict.

Mike is addicted to lying. He is addicted to words. What he needs now is not reporters in his face feeding his addiction, what he needs is compassionate friends, family, and spiritual mentors to help his heart heal.

I think it is appropriate for this community to discuss the topic. This is a blog community centered worship and leadership. It is on topic and we can learn from the successes and failures of others. This is healthy.

peace|dewde
http://dewde.com

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Andrew — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 10:54:42 -0000

I think we can all learn a very important lesson from this. Sin is serious. It forces us to seclude ourselves and hide in shame. But you know what? I say no more. Let's expose our sins to God and to one another while they are controllable. Better to admit an addiction to pornography and have it dealt with than to admit your entire life is a lie. Know what I mean?

All of this out of an addiction to pornography? I can see it. Can't you? Our secret sins will destroy us and those around us. It's time to accept the grace of God and let go of the shame. If we don't we will all end up like this. Maybe not so publicly, but it will happen.

God bless you mike, We are all praying for you.

1 John 1:9
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Rachel — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 10:44:00 -0000

Los, I appreciate that you posted the video. But my question is this: do our opinions really matter in all this? We seem to pretty readily offer them, but 1) we're not God and 2) we don't know Mike.

Just a thought.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

tricia — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 10:15:20 -0000

This story is so sad. I hope he gets the help he needs. And as for the song - I know that it brought hope to people and I hope that doesn't change, based on this circumstance.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Jan — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 09:23:52 -0000

I think the whole story is really sad. The guy is forgiven by God if he has asked for it, but that doesn't erase the stuff he will have to reap for many years. I think about his family, I would be so ticked if I was his wife or parents, too much turmoil and lies. It will take years to regain their full trust, if it can ever be had again.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Greg — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 08:49:21 -0000

Normally I dont interject in comment sections like this... but I'll make an exception here.

Forgiveness is essential... sure. Justice is also though. And not that we need to be his judge, but seriously... every time one of us plays that song, or downloads it from itunes... who's getting paid. Sure, he's giving the royalties away... but look at his track record on truth telling. Mmmmm... wont catch me near that song... There are plenty of other "anointed" songs (what ever that means).

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

DenOfThieves — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 06:19:29 -0000

I would like to believe him. But is hard to believe a liar. Gosh the people at his church seem pretty quick to forgive him? It's like "yeah yeah, we forgive you, now give us more great worship services".
It's almost like they didn't really care if it was real or not.
Emotions are such bit part of these big church services. It's hard to say what is exceptable as far as manipulation of a congregation's emotions. I mean even the old keys playing through a prayer is a way of 'enhancing' emotional response. It wouldn't be difficult for this kind of thing to get out of control and even if the person up the front singing the heart wrenching song, to the crying fans is lying, you still get the high emotional payoff at the end of the day.
Christian celebrity is just recipe for disaster, and christian consumers just wanna eat it up. Even if it all goes wrong, it makes it all more interesting. We can read about it magazines and watch it on TV. Just more entertainment.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

annon. — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 00:15:55 -0000

I mostly lurk around here... maybe this is my third comment ever.
Interesting thread.

My husband has been addicted to pornography most of our married life. I found out when I was pregnant with our third child.
All I can say is the way that he compartmentalized his life was surreal and the denial was something I've never been able to understand. Healing was a long process. is a long process.

When I first heard about this story my first thought was... in what ways do I live a lie? IS there anything in my life that desires man's approval and acceptance over truth and character... are there any places in my life where I am looking for the validation of my peers over being loved by my Jesus?

I wonder if this is what it was like for King David when he cheated on his wife, and had her husband murdered. It would be safe to assume that he had a love vacuum all alone in the fields with his dad's sheep. His dad who barely remembered him when Samuel came along.
The shame, the confession, the falling forward, getting help, healing, living with the ramifications.
I think it's flippin' genius of God to give M. the song "healer" as a prophecy over his life, and a glimps into the heart of God for him and so many others.

The song means more to me now knowing his personal story than it did before because I see God shoveling out mercy with a desire to hold him close to His heart and love him to wholeness.
ISn't it like Jesus to give a song of healing to the one who is broken and in need of it?

I would like to know how much of the spiritual part of the interview got edited out

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Jake — Wed, 03 Sep 2008 23:01:21 -0000

I agree with Overpeck. The bigger issue here is the unabomber beard.

Lots of good insight on this thread, especially that God is LOVE, and he forgives every sin. Although, the wages of sin is death. So he's probably going to die soon.

Kidding.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

KAT — Wed, 03 Sep 2008 21:39:37 -0000

I just hate the fact that he didn't seem like he was holding on to Jesus in the middle of all of this, because Jesus is the ONLY thing that will get him through.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Jenn — Wed, 03 Sep 2008 21:29:46 -0000

I can't judge him... I'm glad he's saying sorry and saying that he will return money and that he finally told the truth, which couldn't have been easy to do. I'll be praying that somehow, God will be glorified in this situation. We need to pray more for those in leadership as they have influence over many. My sister's youth pastor left his wife for another woman last year and late last week, he committed suicide. It's just so, so sad. We're all screwed up, selfish, and sinful. I agree that we need to look to God as our source of strength, truth, and perfection.

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

metromom — Wed, 03 Sep 2008 21:29:18 -0000

One thought we all must focus on more...it will keep us from hurt and keep us (as ministers) from hurting others.

It's not about the "man of God" It's all about the "God of Man".

Re: Ragamuffin Soul » Healer Apology

Amy — Wed, 03 Sep 2008 20:39:50 -0000

I feel bad for the guy, who knows his true motives besides God. I can only hope that the people who he brought into faith and donated money aren't detoured by the person because a wise woman told me "don't judge church or God or your faith by a "person" he is only human we all make mistake his has been seen by the whole world. I'm sure he is already recieving tons of scrutiny from everyone who has a chance. I hope that we can all have some forgiveness and pray for him to get better whatever better may be. I hope those people can either get there money back or see it some how go to a greater cause.